The February 2021 edition of Common Climber is themed around rock climbing couples. Here we interview climbing couple Jeantique and Natalie, who are based in London, United Kingdom. We learn what makes them tick and how they approach climbing and life as a couple.
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Every couple’s story has a beginning. Tell us about yours. How did climbing fit into all of that?
JEANTIQUE: We actually met through climbing! We were both attending a women’s improver class at a wall in London, and even though usually there are about 5 people in the class, that week it was only us two. So besides the teacher we only had one another to chat with. After the class we decided to carry on climbing together. We realised that we had a lot in common, like we both studied Psychology, and have a background in mental health, for example. We exchanged numbers so that we could climb together again and then over the next few weeks we ended up chatting non-stop over WhatsApp. I guess it must have been a little flirty for us to both realise that something "more than friends" might be going on! After a few weeks of climbing together and getting to know one another, I asked Natalie if she wanted to go out for pizza after a bouldering session. I would say that was our first date but Natalie would argue that was our first "not-date," because it was kind of unclear what was going on between us at that point. It’s pretty hard when you’re a woman who dates women to always know if the other person is even romantically interested or literally just being friendly. I remember putting in little hints that I dated women and I knew Natalie did because she had told me she got her climbing shoes from her ex-girlfriend. After a few weeks of this flirty but uncertain back and forth, I just had to take the plunge and ask Nat what was going on between us because I was overthinking everything and worried she didn’t like me back and that I was misreading signals even though my gaydar bells were ringing. I just tried to make it light even though I was melting inside, so I asked her if she could “be straight with me" (excuse the pun) about what was going on between us, and then we talked it all through pretty openly. I’d say that’s when our relationship took on a new level because the mutual interest was out in the open. |
Natalie doing some top rope climbing at a London climbing center.
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In terms of climbing, we ended up climbing a lot together; we did go out on "normal" dates too but most of our relationship was built during climbing time. I find socialising quite difficult generally, but climbing really gives me a new level of confidence in relationships. I find it so grounding and it brings out my most playful, calm, but confident self. I liked that Natalie got to see that version of me from the start.
NATALIE: I feel similarly. I definitely found it easier to build our relationship through climbing at the start; like even though there were undertones from early on, we kind of just got to know each other through a shared love for the sport and wanting to climb together without it having to be romantic or there being any pressure - like there might be if we met through a dating app or something. I’m just really thankful for climbing because if I hadn’t gone to that class that day I never would have met Jeantique and my life would be totally different right now. I wasn’t even that into climbing before, I mean I was, but reasonably new, so hadn’t really established any climbing friendship groups or anything. In the same way that climbing brought us together, being together and having a climbing partner who just loves climbing so much and gets so excited over climbing, is really infectious. I guess she made me fall more in love with the sport. |
Jeantique bouldering at a Blokfest competition.
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How and when did the two of you start climbing?
JEANTIQUE: I started climbing around three years ago. I sort of just stumbled across it when an old friend and I decided to join an intro-to-bouldering class to celebrate our birthdays. We just saw a cheap voucher on Groupon and thought it would be fun! I didn’t even know what bouldering was and was expecting ropes, so it was a real journey into something totally new and unknown for me. I fell in love with it pretty immediately though. I have a condition that affects my connective tissue and causes chronic pain so most sports are too painful or difficult for me and I hadn’t been able to do much sport for a while even though I was very sporty as a child. I got lucky stumbling across climbing because climbing is literally the perfect sport for my body and it was like my body knew it from the very start.
NATALIE: I started climbing about two-and-a-half years ago, actually an ex-girlfriend introduced me to it. She took me climbing when we were together. After we broke up I continued going on my own until I met Jeantique.
Jeantique toproping at the ParaClimbing Nationals.
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Do each of you have a favorite type or style of climbing?
NATALIE: I would say probably bouldering, although it changes to be honest. I really like the challenge of bouldering and trying to figure out routes and moves together which you can’t really do with top-roping; but then sometimes it’s also really nice to have your own personal challenge on a rope and ropes can be more rewarding in terms of building endurance. I only recently started outdoor climbing, and covid has sort of gotten in the way, but it feels like a whole different type of challenge – you have no idea what a hold is going to feel like or if you’re about to just put your hand into a web of creepy crawlies! I guess it feels more... maybe not dangerous, but like more of an adventure. And I also love being in nature. So it’s hard to pick a favourite because I personally enjoy being a bit of an all-rounder. JEANTIQUE: I feel pretty similarly to be honest. My ultimate favourite is probably bouldering. I just love how it combines so many elements and the creativity and problem-solving side of it gets me really excited. I’m literally like a kid in a candy shop. Projecting boulders especially with friends or Natalie and working out each move is so fulfilling. The variety of moves, holds, body positions, angles etc is so vast, it’s like an art. For me it’s also a means to socialise because you can be chatting and bonding whilst bouldering, just sitting around on the mats in between climbs bonding. Whereas with ropes it’s more of an individual sport, unless you want to be shouting up a wall so the whole centre can hear you! |
I do love ropes too, though. Top-roping means I can push myself to a much higher limit (because bouldering is much riskier with my bad joints so I have to climb within a more narrow limit). I also love the thrill and empowering feeling that comes with leading and am known to love leading roofs. I feel safer falling and swinging into air than falling and crashing into a wall. I also love outdoor climbing because I love being in nature, feeling real rock, and being in the fresh air. But I haven’t been climbing outside much and it’s definitely a lot scarier and harder, even just logistically. Overall whenever I don’t go bouldering for a while and then come back to it, I realise just how much I love it. Almost as much as I love Natalie – so definitely a boulderer at heart!
Natalie bouldering during their visit to Salzburg, Austria.
Jeantique, you have a condition called hypermobile Ehlers Danlos Syndrome (hEDS) which is a genetic connective tissue disorder that affects collagen which is basically the glue that holds all the structures in the body together. To provide a little background for our readers, hEDS’s effects include frequent full or partial joint dislocations, chronic muscle and joint pain, and various multi-systemic issues related to the gut, heart, skin, bladder, autonomic nervous system and more. Basically it impacts the entire body because our connective tissue and collagen is everywhere.
In EDS, to make up for having collagen that doesn’t function properly, the muscles end up taking on the role of holding everything in place. Climbing is obviously a great way of strengthening muscles, but if we push it too hard, too fast, we get injured, especially with a condition like EDS. How do you navigate this issue and how has climbing impacted your hEDS and your hEDS impacted climbing?
JEANTIQUE: People can find it hard to understand how I can climb despite currently being unable to work, for example, but honestly climbing has been a game changer for me in terms of my health issues. It’s the best form of physiotherapy for my body and has helped my joint instability and pain significantly – I always joke that I am in less pain on the wall than I am when I’m sitting or standing, and it’s 100% true! I struggle to do other sports or even day to day activities like washing up, because they either cause pain or are just too much for my body. But climbing is different - it combines all the elements suitable for someone with EDS: it’s controlled, low-impact, non-repetitive, and targets multiple muscle groups in the body at once. It is the perfect way of building strength, and the stronger our muscles the better they are at stabilising our joints. So thankfully for me, finding climbing has been the most beneficial thing for my EDS.
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In terms of how EDS affects my climbing, it does quite a bit, but I climb in quite an adaptive way to work around it and it’s definitely worth it. I’d say the most difficult part of climbing is getting there and back on public transport! I am also really lucky though because I’m so active in the paraclimbing community in London so a lot of my climbing friends also have disabilities. We all support each other when climbing to adapt in any ways we need. Some of the things that make climbing challenging include my joints subluxing (partially dislocating) whilst I’m climbing – most specifically my wrists – which is pretty inconvenient! I am also very prone to injury, so I take steps to minimise injuries - like always climbing down (not jumping) when boudering, using tape or supports for my joints, wearing knee pads, and not pushing myself beyond my comfort zone in case I might fall (unless I am on a rope). Generally I listen to my body so I don’t pull anything. I also adapt the way I warm up to suit my body. My joints and other issues make belaying hard so I wear belayer glasses to avoid craning my neck. I also often belay from the ground after tying myself into the floor so I can sit down!
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A playful Natalie.
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You have spent considerable time in the hospital, how has that impacted your relationship with Natalie?
I was in hospital for three months in 2020 and Natalie was stuck living with my family without me during the middle of a pandemic! It was definitely a very challenging time for both of us. It was really hard for her to see me so unwell and hard for both of us to be without one another for so long. I was so weak and unable to care for myself because of how malnourished I was. I felt really guilty being unable to give back equally in the relationship. I think that was the hardest part for me; feeling like I was a burden and that Natalie was in a position of having to be my caretaker when I couldn’t reciprocate, which is not our usual dynamic. Overall though me being in hospital definitely made our relationship stronger. For me being so unwell made me evaluate what matters to me most in life and I just feel so lucky to have Natalie. I honestly don’t know how I would have gotten through such a hard time without her. Sometimes it felt like I was fighting for her and the thought of our life together helped me fight my way back to better health. For Natalie it also brought up questions of not knowing what the future might look like with me being so unwell. We didn’t know how much better I would get. It understandably made her question if she could cope with everything with such uncertainty about the future over our heads. Ultimately her love for me trumped that uncertainty and fear and she knew she could never not be with me, which is how I feel about her too – cheesy I know but true! I know that after what we went through last year, we will be able to get through anything.
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Jeantique, you are a paraclimber and have competed at the UK National Paraclimbing Championships, tell us more about that and how competition and training impacts your relationship. A few of my friends are on the Great Britain para team and encouraged me to go along to Nationals. I went in 2019 and came 3rd in my category and then last year I came 2nd and I really enjoyed the whole experience. Honestly, I am a very chilled climber and whilst I enjoy the competitive side of climbing, it isn’t my main focus. I basically just climb as hard as I can and try and get as good as I can in the same way I imagine most people do, and then I compete if the opportunity is there because I enjoy it both for the thrill and challenge but also the community aspect and representing EDS in paraclimbing. I basically promised myself that I’d never let the competitive side of climbing take away from the fun and joy I get from it, so luckily I don’t think anything training related affects our relationship. I think the main issue we’ve had relating to competitions has been over the long drives because Nat ends up driving us for hours up to somewhere like Sheffield and we can sometimes have little tifs trying to organise everything, but nothing major! To be honest I’m not actually sure what the future of comps hold for me now anyway as as of this week, the IFSC (International Federation of Sport Climbing) have announced that they will be changing from the current classification system to the IPC (International Paraclimbing Committee) one, which essentially is extremely discriminatory and will exclude a lot of conditions that are currently eligible, including EDS, so I don’t even know if I’ll have a category to climb in any longer! |
Jeantique chalking up
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What attracted you two to each other?
JEANTIQUE: I’m demisexual so I can only tell if I’m romantically attracted to someone after getting to know them and their personality. So for me it was more of a case of getting to know Natalie over time and having to trust that what was developing between us was romantic even though I wasn’t necessarily sure for a while! For the first few months I remember being like "Do I like her? I think I like her? But I can’t tell? Can I trust this feeling?" and having to ride with that feeling of uncertainty until something clicked and I was like "Yeah, I definitely like her!." Ultimately I think it was a bunch of things; her sensitive and caring nature, her witty sense of humour, her high level of intelligence, our shared interests in lots of things (e.g. the environment, animals, climbing, science, games, etc.). I think we click and bounce off each other really well. It all felt so natural being with her, especially as I’d never been in a long term relationship before and she made me feel so safe and cared about. I also was really attracted to her ability to be unapologetically gay and loud about it during a time when I was confused about my sexuality – it definitely helped me on my own journey and in coming out.
NATALIE: The first thing I noticed was Jeantique’s smile. She smiles a lot – when she’s climbing, when she’s doing random tasks, etc. It’s a very radiant smile and it seems like she has this real enthusiasm for things which I was really attracted to. She also has really cool tattoos I liked on a more superficial level. Those were some things that initially intrigued me about her. Then also she was really good at climbing, which made me want to climb with her. At the beginning it was more of a feeling of being intrigued, as opposed to an attraction, but that did still make me follow her around the climbing centre! As we got to know each other I found her really interesting and intelligent and we have quite a similar and silly sense of humour. I think it just grew from there; I just wanted to know more and more about her.
Jeantique (left) and Natalie (right) with competative and Olympic climber Shauna Coxsey (center).
Do you ever argue about climbing? If so what topic and how do you navigate it?
JEANTIQUE: Not really - I think overall, climbing really brings us together. One small argument I can think of is related to what I mentioned above with practicalities of comps. There have probably been a few at the wall where one of us gets a bit hard on ourselves for not being able to do a climb and we might have a bit of a strop. Then the other one tries to remain calm and rational, which can be a bit hard (we are both quite sensitive and emotional creatures), but that’s pretty much it thankfully! I would say our main tactic is open communication; so if there’s ever an issue, no matter how silly it might feel, always trying our best to be as open and expressive about it at the time to talk through what’s going on, instead of burying feelings down because that doesn’t work for either of us – or anyone I know for that matter!
You and Natalie are part of the LGBTQ community. How is the LGBTQ community received in the UK in general as well as in the climbing community there?
JEANTIQUE: To be honest I only came out a couple of years ago, so my experience of the community hasn’t been extensive. What I have experienced has been pretty much all positive, so I count myself very lucky. The first place I came out was actually within the climbing community and I think this set a really good precedent for me because generally the climbing community in London is so LGBTQ+ friendly. It definitely helped me feel more comfortable with coming out about my sexuality and being with Natalie outside of the climbing world. I always appreciate the efforts the climbing community goes to in London to be as inclusive as possible, for example putting up the Pride flag or rainbow coloured patterns of holds during Pride month, running LGBTQ+ climbing events, etc.
NATALIE: I have had both positive and negative experiences as an LGBTQ+ person – mostly positive though. I do feel quite lucky in this country that my existence isn’t against the law or anything. It’s not the same in other countries. I did grow up in a very heteronormative society outside of London however, and it felt like often I couldn’t be myself. I feel like outside of London is a different England, to be honest. I didn’t really realise until my 20s that I was gay because I’d sort of pushed that part of myself down because of my environment. When I did come out, it felt like a process of coming out, not just one event. Even once you come out, you are still always having to come out in new contexts – every new job, every new social situation, etc. You almost need to test the waters to make sure it’s safe. Usually it’s received positively and warmly, but, not always. In a climbing environment I feel very comfortable being myself and I’ve never felt like I can’t be openly gay or talk about my sexuality in climbing – so I actually feel more safe in the climbing community than I would generally in other UK places. But, my knowledge of the country with attitudes towards the LGBTQ+ community, and in particular transphobia, is that it has increased in recent years – so I do think it’s important to stay aware of.
JEANTIQUE: To be honest I only came out a couple of years ago, so my experience of the community hasn’t been extensive. What I have experienced has been pretty much all positive, so I count myself very lucky. The first place I came out was actually within the climbing community and I think this set a really good precedent for me because generally the climbing community in London is so LGBTQ+ friendly. It definitely helped me feel more comfortable with coming out about my sexuality and being with Natalie outside of the climbing world. I always appreciate the efforts the climbing community goes to in London to be as inclusive as possible, for example putting up the Pride flag or rainbow coloured patterns of holds during Pride month, running LGBTQ+ climbing events, etc.
NATALIE: I have had both positive and negative experiences as an LGBTQ+ person – mostly positive though. I do feel quite lucky in this country that my existence isn’t against the law or anything. It’s not the same in other countries. I did grow up in a very heteronormative society outside of London however, and it felt like often I couldn’t be myself. I feel like outside of London is a different England, to be honest. I didn’t really realise until my 20s that I was gay because I’d sort of pushed that part of myself down because of my environment. When I did come out, it felt like a process of coming out, not just one event. Even once you come out, you are still always having to come out in new contexts – every new job, every new social situation, etc. You almost need to test the waters to make sure it’s safe. Usually it’s received positively and warmly, but, not always. In a climbing environment I feel very comfortable being myself and I’ve never felt like I can’t be openly gay or talk about my sexuality in climbing – so I actually feel more safe in the climbing community than I would generally in other UK places. But, my knowledge of the country with attitudes towards the LGBTQ+ community, and in particular transphobia, is that it has increased in recent years – so I do think it’s important to stay aware of.
Jeantique (left) and Natalie (right) in the 2019 London Pride parade with Keshet - a Jewish LGBTQ+ charity.
What would you like to see in the climbing community with respect to LGBTQ representation and issues?
JEANTIQUE: Maybe more recruitment of staff from the LGBTQ+ community and more effort by walls to represent LGBTQ+ climbers on their social media, so that the climbing community can see as much diversity represented as possible. I think at the moment there is still very much a feeling of "this is what a climber looks like" on social media, with videos of mostly strong white straight men pulling themselves up a wall for example. I really believe in the message that "climbing is for everyone" and think it would be great if this could be showcased more overtly across social media platforms and beyond. I do love what a lot of climbing walls do during Pride month (and the rest of the year) for the community that I mentioned above and hope that this is continued and that more walls take notice and join.
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Do you have a climbing story that illustrates who you are as a couple?
JEANTIQUE: The first example I thought of is when I asked Natalie to officially be my girlfriend. We were literally just cuddling on the floor on a bouldering centre during a rest break, a couple of weeks or months into our relationship. I just spontaneously turned to Natalie and said "Can I ask you a question?" Then I got shy as she expressed curiosity. Eventually I summoned up the courage and said "Do you want to be my girlfriend, like officially?" (I’m not great at the whole dating thing!) She said yes, and now every time we are in that part of the bouldering centre, we remember the day we became official and reminisce over it. Add to that moment the fact we went out for a pizza date straight after in our climbing clothes for vegan pizza to celebrate. I’d say that encapsulates us and our relationship pretty well! I’d also say that the whole process and story behind building our home climbing wall also illustrates us as a couple. We spent about a month researching obsessively and the entire process took over three months, but we are so proud of our home wall – called The Hangover. It was such a fun shared project. We got to have a lot of laughs and silly moments, get both of our families involved, as well as all the neighbours. We used our individual and shared skills and knowledge, and did something empowering and impressive together. It was yet another way that something climbing related has brought us together and it has given us lots of joy and hope turning our home wall vision into a reality, during what has been a really difficult time. |
The home bouldering wall - a project Natalie and Jeantique accomplished together.
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Do you have any goals or visions for you as a couple and for your individual climbing?
JEATIQUE: For me, honestly, the only thing I need and want from climbing at this point in time is to be able to go back to it. The pandemic, as well as being so unwell last year, have made me realise how much I need climbing to keep me physically and mentally well. I miss it with every bone in my body. Now that I’m not eligible to compete in a national category in the paraclimbing competitions, I am not as bothered about the competitive side of climbing. I will still compete where I can, for both the challenge and the fun of it, but also because I love being part of the paraclimbing community. I hope that the new community I have set up for paraclimbers with EDS (see @eds_climbers on Instagram) will continue to grow and support its members, and I plan on running a big social event for the community as soon as it’s safe to.
In terms of couple climbing related goals, I’m also excited to plan and go on more outdoor climbing trips. Although Natalie and I have climbed outside separately, we have yet to go outside together. As a couple, my hope for us is that we will be able to continue climbing together until we can no longer climb! I can envision us with our future kids going on climbing adventures together and it’s a lovely warm feeling.
NATALIE: I feel similarly. I don’t have any specific climbing goals but I agree I definitely do want to climb together more outside and maybe go on some more adventurous climbing trips together. We have two adventure trips to Italy planned, so hopefully will actually get to go on them when it’s safe (the trips have been pushed back multiple times already because of the pandemic!) I think goals can be good, but to be honest we have so much fun climbing together and really I just want to be able to do more of that. I have big plans for our future climbing kids too!
Love on the wall - Natalie (left) and Jeantique (right)
Is there any advice you’d share for climbing couples out there?
JEANTIQUE: Our main advice would be to develop a sense of identity both as a couple and as individuals in climbing. It’s important to me to have my own identity as a climber and a paraclimber, for example, and it’s also important to me have a sense of shared identity with Natalie as climbers (plural) and as a queer climbing couple. It’s an amazing thing to be able to do together and to have shared goals, but also okay to take healthy space and need time apart to work on individual ones – just like in any and all other areas of life.
We also think that making the conscious effort to encourage and complement one another is really important. It means a lot to us when the other one gets excited over our climbing achievements or expresses that she’s proud of something climbing related. This doesn’t have to focus on just sending climbs either – that’s something important to note – but can be about facing a fear, or doing a tricky move, or noticing how perseverant or creative or passionate the other person is being. Especially right now in the pandemic when a lot of us might be losing strength and progress, it’s important that we can recognise these successes in those around us. We both appreciate it when we are enthusiastic and positive towards one another in our climbing endeavours, as well as outside of them.
Overall, we wouldn’t really give different advice to a climbing couple compared to any other LGBTQ+ couple, or any couple for that matter. For all couples, or in any relationships, we think that the most important thing is communication! Nothing magic ;-).
FOLLOW ALONG!
INSTAGRAM:
INSTAGRAM:
- @big_furby_energy for Natalie
- @paraclimber_jeantique
- @eds_climbers a community Jeantique set up for climbers with EDS (Ehlers Danlos Syndrome)